us-005578-irn1004879
type: RecordSet
date: 1987 May 19
has or had holder: us-005578
has or had identifier: 1
has or had identifier: 2
has or had some members with language: fra
has record set type: Item
identifier: irn1004879
note: Abbreviated transcript with real time code idents available in departmental files.
scope and content: 14:56 Witness Holtfort testifies, via an interpreter, that the documents presented to him by President Cerdini for verification are indeed authentic 15:07 Cerdini asks Holtfort whether, in his professional opinion, it is possible that the signature of Barbie's name was in fact written by someone else. Holtfort replies that theoretically, yes, but he has never seen a case of that in his years of research in this topic 15:10 Holtfort continues that, given the hierarchy of the SIPO-SD, a false signature would have been illegal and simply wouldn't have happened. Cerdini asks Holtfort to testify as to his understanding of the hierarchy and chain of command within the SIPO-SD, and its relation to the RSHA (Reich Main Security Office, in Berlin). 15:19 Cerdini asks Holtfort whether, given the documents in hand, the UGIF and Izieu raids were the direct initiatives of the Lyon KDS office, or stemmed from external orders. Holtfort testifies that these raids occurred rather late in the war (1944) and that at this time, many orders came from the BDS office in Paris to round up and deport Jews from regional KDS outposts. In April 1944, as it was becoming more difficult for the BDS in Paris to deport Jews, a letter was sent from Paris to all of the regional commanders, giving them the power to direct their own deportation initiatives without additional oversight from Paris. 15:26 An attorney asks that Mr. Streim, who had already testified the previous day, be called to testify with Mr. Holtfort in order to ascertain more specifically what powers an individual SS officer held, and specifically a Lyon SS officer. 15:27 The attorney asks both witnesses to testify to their understanding of the relations between the State and the Nazi Party, and how these were impacted by the law of October 1, 1933. The interpreter replies that neither can testify to this. 15:29 The attorney asks the two witnesses to speak to the history and organization of the SS, and its relation to the Nazi party. …
title: Barbie Trial -- Day 7 -- Two experts testify